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Home Forums General Discussion Why is PVC not Enviromentally friendly?

This topic contains 6 replies, has 2 voices, and was last updated by  caverdude 6 years, 2 months ago.

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  • #36864

    caverdude
    Participant

    Whats up with PVC? I can imagine a world without gas and oil and diesel, but not without plastics. Is it that plastics are not bio-degradable? They last too long as trash? Is that why they are so bad?

    http://larrydgray.net

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    #41598

    Dustoffer
    Participant

    I did some extensive research on PVC in the late 1980s. from research done on it in the late 1970s and early 1980s. There are billions of pounds of it made each year and much ends up in landfills. Credit cards, shower curtains, vent pipes, siding, electrical insulation, vinyl records, and many more products. The problem is that when it begins to vaporize at 200*F and combusts at 400*F on up to the breakdown point of 3,000*F, it turns into PVC gas. One pound can kill up to 400 grown men

    in 15 seconds, or cause up to 10,000 cases of various cancers. 70% are incurable liver cancers, 11% brain cancers, 9% lung cancers, and an assortment of other odd cancers. Break down at 3,000*F yields carbon monoxide and mustard gas. It takes up to 50,000 years to break down in landfills. When exposed to strong UV it lets off a chlorine molecule which helps degrade the ozone layer. It really is a much worse problem than all the

    nuclear waste. Still, it is used in cheapo lawn furniture and

    so many other things from China(with downwinders dying at a young age, and lesser environmental regulations). They can reuse it in lower structural grade. For the most part it is a polymer that is difficult to recycle, so as to be considered non-recyclable by US companies. The people that used to work at cleaning the inside of the PVC polymerization tanks would die within 4 months of cancer. So respirators are now required. It used to be used

    for water pipes, but caused stomach cancer within 10 years, so is outlawed for water supplies. You can not even use a PVC inflatable at most water supply reservoirs because of leaching. If you lit your credit card in the confines of a small bathroom, it would kill you. Even some firemen do not know of its toxicity and die of cancers after fighting home fires, from the PVC shower curtains to vent pipes to the nightmare of a PVC sided house burning. In NYC a PVC blackout curtain was used in a bar under the regualar cloth curtain. A disgruntled patron lit the curtain and left. The 12 people in the bar were found still on their stools with a hand on their drink, after the fire dept. put out the blaze. That was in the early 1980s. Some firefighters are well aware of it and wear respirators.

    #41600

    caverdude
    Participant

    Well someone needs to do a Dave Ramsey http://www.daveramsey.com “Plasectemy” which is a short video clip showing unique ways to destroy credit cards. This clip sould have someone in full cheimical gear and breathing apparatus burning a credit card with long metal working tongs. Should have caption, “Credit cards are evil in more ways than one!” He has folks make these video’s for his tv show on fox business news network.

    Well I’ll look into it, but yes I suppose burning of any plastics are more haszardous than most of us think about. I recall once as a kid, I had a plastic coke bottle 1 or 2 liter on a stick. I was holding it above a trash fire watching it melt. As it melted it sealed the bottle neck so that it began to blow up a little like a ballon. Then it poped and blew molten plastic all over me and my face lol. Didn’t leave a scar but scared the living poo out of me.

    http://larrydgray.net

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    #41601

    caverdude
    Participant

    But on the cancer causing with drinking water note: We used pvc for everything on the farm that watered animals. And I don’t recall high rates of cancer deaths in poultry or livestock. I know pvc is used very heavily in agricultural use for watering plants and animals.

    http://larrydgray.net

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    #41608

    Dustoffer
    Participant

    Pop bottles are not made with PVC, and livestock do not live long enough to get cancer from PVC pipe leaching. I would wonder what happens over time with the soil and groundwater with heavy plant watering through PVC pipes.

    Plastics are not all equally bad when burned except for the usual CO2, and soot.

    Vinyl plastics are among the worst. Other bad plastics are the polyurethanes, and especially the cyano-plastics which let off cyanogen gas when burned. They are commonly used in aluminum surfaced foam insulation. Rubber also lets off a number of toxins when burned. There are a number of billion tire piles. Their best use is in Earthships, IMHO.

    There are three types of plastic commonly recycled and labeled as such. So it is best to recycle them.

    Even the “non-toxic” ones kill fish and marine life in the 7 huge oceanic trash gyres. They gradually break down into small pieces eaten without nutrition by marine life, starving them. They all are long lasting in the environment, especially in landfills.

    With PVC, minimize its use as much as possible, and understand its toxicity potential. A lot of plumbers who saw cut it and sand it for vent pipes and underground pipes for drainage and venting, do not know, and die younger than they would have.

    #41609

    caverdude
    Participant

    I worked one time at a plant that made school and office furniture, they had a section for making “hard plastics” which used some plastic powder that is mixed with wood saw dust and heated and pressed in forms. This is for making the seats and backs of chairs. This plastic powder says on the container that it “will cause cancer” not “might cause cancer”. They have had several employees die from cancer due to this plastic. I don’t recall seeing any material data sheets on it so I can’t tell you the exact chemical makeup of it.

    http://larrydgray.net

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    #41612

    caverdude
    Participant

    What do you guys think of this article?

    http://gizmodo.com/5818387/let-plastic2oil-turn-your-discarded-plastics-into-fuel

    Plant that converts waste plastics to fuels and gasses.

    http://larrydgray.net

    http://larrydgray.wordpress.com

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